This is Part Seven of Jo-Bert, Step By Step Guide To Setting Up Your Own Reef Aquarium. Albert, What kind of corals are you referring to that could take a whole , yet small piece of food in this manner. It was under the impression that most all corals were filter feeders, or fed off of their zooxanthellae. Jola Jola, Just about all large polyped corals will take pieces of food. Examples include Catalaphyllia, Euphyllia, Goniopora, Plerogyra, etc. ... Small polyped corals tend to filter feed more. Albert Albert, No. "Carlos" did not go into the sand! ROFL Guess what? I did find my Texan Buddy, though! I put him back home on the sand. It was weird when I put him back on the sand. He seemed so excited, for a crab , anyway. He just picked and picked like crazy on the sand, like he was just starving! Jola Jola, Well glad Carlos the Tiger Tail Cucumber is back and swinging. Your Texan Buddy the crab must be eternally thankful that you got him back where he belongs! Good move Jola. You get to know these creature's needs and habits pretty well don't you. Albert Albert, I was thinking the same thing about its shape. I will look harder and see if I can find him. I really like him, I miss the little Texan. Jola Jola, Seems like you did find him wedged in the rocks. So all is under control. Mine only has two long ends, yours has three so I guess it is easier for yours to get caught. Albert Albert, Well, today, when I got home from work, I went over and looked at the Brain. You should see it right now! It 's like -poof-! I mean it is really mega plump! This Brain looks like your mouth feels when you go to the Dentist and get shots in your mouth! Jola Jola, I checked the content of the new Seatest NO3/PO4/Ca++ test kit. It is 25 ml or 25 cc. Since this is a low range test we need to modify the way you use it somewhat. Here is what I suggest you do : Add 2.5 cc of aquarium water to the vial then top it off to 25 cc (the top line). Distilled or RO nitrate free water is best to top-off with. Now perform your test. The results needs to be multiplied by 10 to get an accurate measurement. If you have any questions let me know. Albert Albert, Will anxiously await its arrival! Let me know about the re-confirmation. Jola Jola, I will call Eric of Sea Dwelling Creatures this morning and reconfirm the shipment and then leave you a message. Done ! Thanks. If you need more info just let me know. Albert Jola, Just about all large polyped corals will take pieces of food. Examples include Catalaphyllia, Euphyllia, Goniopora, Plerogyra, etc ... Small polyped corals tend to filter feed more. Albert Albert, I got the Scallops yesterday. Do we need to feed the tank with them today? Just let me know. Jola Jola, Half a scallop shredded up in the blender will do just fine. Leave the "milk" with it and add it all to the tank. Shut the skimmer down for about an hour while you feed but leave all other pumps running. If you have further questions pls. let me know. Albert Albert, Well, I guess Carlos is swinging, I don't really know. He is just there, being a "rock dweller". Guess he does like doing his thing in rocks, instead of sand. ROFL I am learning about the reefies. Will eventually learn all about everything in there. One needs to know about what they keep. Jola Jola, Yes I guess you are absolutely right. The more you know about the animals in your tank the more you can gauge whether they are behaving normally or not. Carlos the Tiger Tail is certainly a baffling animal! Supposed to go in the sand during the night but from what you tell me it has never done so. I will have to ask Kathy at RE about this. Sure sounds like Carlos does not like doing his thing in the sand ) , about not worrying about it those few days that it was not all that thrilled! It came back out , and looks better than -any- Brain that I have ever seen ! Jola Jola, The Brain then finally seems to be in the spot where it needs to be. Your perseverance in finding the right spot did pay off. Great job Jola. Albert Albert, Yes, I will look information up on them. I want to know all about the inhabitants of Jo-Bert. Jola Jola, Yes you should be able to find it in the books you have. If not let me know and I will see where I can find it. Albert Albert, I'm not sure if it is moving it, the additives , or just finally getting acclimated. What would you say is the most probable? Jola Jola, The calcium is bit high but not in any kind of danger zone. Albert Albert, I took a half of a scallop, put it in the food processor with a little bit of RO water and processed it real well. I then dumped the whole thing in front of a power head. The Bubble Coral, got real tenticled, and , just when I thought that the Brain could not get any bigger, guess what ? It got even bigger! The Bubble went back to bubbles after awhile, as well the brain kinda got smaller, although , not much smaller. That Brain is at least 6" in diameter! Jola Jola, Yes that seems like absolutely normal feeding behavior. When the corals feed they take up the food and tend to become smaller until they reopen. Seems to me they sure like the feeding! I gotta see that Brain. It must look real nice. You should make some close up photos of the various corals for the photo library of the tank when you have a chance. Thanks Albert Albert, After I fed the tank the scallop, the ORP went down to 435. Now, 2 hours later, it has slowly risen to 445. Will check this again in the am to see if it rebounds to what it was , which was 452. Jola Jola, Whenever you feed the ORP will go down because you are introducing the food and the organics that go with it. Also when you feed the metabolism and the catabolism processes pollute the water. It takes the skimmer a while to catch up with this and get things back to normal. Small variations of 10 or 20 mv once you are in the range you are in are nothing to worry about anyway. The main thing here was that the corals fed! Albert Albert, I like the new Ca test better than any other that Ive tried. When it changes color, it changes all of a sudden, unlike other kits that slowly change color and you stand there wondering if you need to add one more drop or not. Just wanted to let you know that the ORP bounced back up this am to 465. Jola Jola, Thanks. That is good indeed. Seems like that ORP is really holding up! Albert Albert, Well, the snails are doing fine, there is just not all that many of them. OR I just don't see all that many of them , anyway. I still have to use the algae magnet. The RO water tested at 0 on PO4, and 0 on Nitrite, and just a bare trace of Nitrate. Jola Jola, Where are the algae growing and what kind are they? Good results on the RO water BTW. Do you have X-Phos in the system now? Albert Albert, There are no hair algae present. I still have the 50/50 combination of X-Silicate and X-Phosphate in the carbon chamber of the skimmer. Jola Jola, Great. Glad to hear there are no hair algae. Of course, the little herm crabs do a real good job at keeping things in check even if there were any. Pls. change the bag of 50/50 X-Sil and X-Phos after it has been in the tank for a week or so. Make sure to rinse it well before adding it to the tank. Albert Albert, Well, I do need to change that then. Will do. Jola Jola, If you have had them in there for a long time (more than a week) you should really change it. Albert Albert, Yesterday, when I posted you the test results, I made a typo on the PO4 reading . The correct reading on the PO4 yesterday at 6pm was 0.2ppm. Jola Jola : Now that is much much better. 0.2 ppm is still a little high tough but not nearly as bad as 1.2 ppm. After all the trouble with the skimmer I took it off and the ORP is now 432 ! Albert Albert, A few test results at 12 noon on June 9th are as follows: ORP- 467 pH- 8.39 PO4- 0.7mg/L Notice the PO4 increase from 0.2 yesterday at 6pm. Any ideas on why it would increase in this manner? Jola Jola, Have you been putting in less KW maybe as that would cause the PO4 to not precipitate. I would make sure to have X-PO4 in the tank to lower it. The feeding has also contributed to the increase of course. Albert Albert, The evaporated water is replaced with KW drip, the same as usual. So, I have not decreased the KW. Jola Jola, Is the drip rate about the same as it was? We seem to have enough in as much as the pH is up there and the calcium level is as well. I would not change anything to that set up for the time being anyway. Seems like all is doing well in Jo-Bert ! Albert Albert, Yes, the drip is about the same as it was, although sometimes it does add to much KW to the system because of the fluctuations in the humidity and weather related stuff. All is well in Jo- Bert except for the Bubble still being mad and the Leather still being mad. Jola Jola, I have no problem with your adding a little too much KW. That cannot hurt the system especially since it is dripped in. The addition of the extra large Elegance obviously upset the Bubble (which did not really look all that great to begin with) and the Leather. This will change in a while. If not we will have to decide how to handle this. Placement and change of currents may be necessary but let's wait and see what happens in a few days. Sometimes corals take a while to adjust. The XL Elegance is an overpowering coral and can affect the others to some degree. We can deal with that if this continues so you should not worry at this point. Albert Albert, I have been keeping up with the evaporation as far as adding KW is concerned. There is still the 50/50 mixture of X-Silicate and X-P04 in the carbon chamber of the skimmer. Jola Jola, As you indicated that evaporation changes in your area due to the climate it is indeed a good idea and practice to check from time to time to make sure the drip is keeping up. Power to you. Real good job Jola. Re your PO4 test results ... is it possible that you used the test vial that yesterday was used for the nitrate test and today used it for the phosphate test? I noticed a month or two ago that I suddenly had a 1ppm reading whereas it is normally 0 (using Seatest's). What had happened was that the color chips had fallen out, I mixed up the vials and clearly I had not cleaned the test vial sufficiently. Just a possibility ... especially as a 0.5 ppm jump is ALOT. FWIW Andy Andy, Well, in the case of the new test kit, there is only one vial provided for all the tests. This am, before I performed the tests, I rinsed the vial-very- well. Then, rinsed the vial very well between the tests. Jola Jola, Ah, that's bad news that they only supply the one vial. FWIW try washing the vial using boiling RO water and let is stand for 10 minutes. BTW what do you do? I know Bobby works at the car place but you've never said about yourself .... Andy Jola, How is everything going this morning in the tank with the lights out? Albert Albert, All is at rest in Jo-Bert this am. Jola Jola, Can you run another PO4 and NO3 test this morning before the lights go on and post a message with the results. Thank you. Albert Albert, Test results that you requested at 9:30 am are as follows: PO4- 0.1 N03- <8ppm ORP- 473 pH- 8.32 Jola Jola, Thanks for the set of test results. Guess the NO3 is back on its way down and the PO4 as well. Andy made an excellent point about rinsing the vials. Also, when testing for phosphate do not touch the interior of the vial with your fingers. this will increase the PO4 reading. Albert Jola, Apart from the PO4, you really are getting some fantastic results ... what is the calcium running at? Andy Andy, On June the 8th at 6pm, the Ca was testing at 525. Right now, the ORP is 473. Jola Jola, Your tank really is getting some brilliant results. Congrats! Andy Albert, I must tell you, even though I had the unfortunate incidence with the employee of Eric's poor shipping practice, you would just have to see this Elegance! It is just the most beautiful Elegance that I have ever seen! It is just huge and really fantastic! Please relay this info to Eric at Sea Dwelling Creatures for this magnificent specimen! Jola Jola, Thank you. Next time I speak to Eric I will let him know. I have ordered from Sea Dwelling Creatures for a lot of other hobbyists and have always had real good specimens. I can get real unusual fish on special order from them for any hobbyist who is interested. I can also get special corals. Glad the Elegance is doing so well. Albert Albert, Well, I hope he can find the Black and White Clownfish! Jola Jola, I put an order in with Sea Dwelling Creatures for Amphiprion latezonatus for you and also for me. Eric told me he would let me know when he gets some in. Albert Albert, Your getting some too? Oh God, this is so fantastic! I just cant wait!!! I will cry for sure! I know, I know, you're thinking "Get a life, already!" Do you think that they will be okay and not get sick? Do you think that they will love their anemone? Are you still considering putting the D. Sailfin in Jo-Bert? Jola Jola, Yes as soon as Eric has some he will send us both some. He does not know when though. They do not come in as regularly as other varieties. There are never any guarantees but if they are handled well and acclimated well there is no reason for them to get sick. As far as I know they only like Heteractis crispa anemones. If Eric does not have any I know another place that does. I have not made up my mind yet about D-Sailfin. He IS big. Albert Jola, I just finished reviewing the Jo-Bert files. It made me exhausted just thinking of the amount of work you put into your tank. I just wanted to give you a "pat on the back" for your willingness and enthusiasm that ends up helping all of us! Howard and Stacey Howard & Stacey, Thank you so much for your kind and thoughtful words! If there is ever any question that you might have about how I've dealt with any problems in Jo-Bert, please don't hesitate to ask! Sincerely, Jola Albert, The Leather and the Devil's Hand are still mad about the addition of the Elegance. Is there anything that I need to do? They are on opposite ends of the tank for the most part. The Brain could care less, it is still really mega-huge! Jola Jola, Ho-hum, don't suppose you want me to say anything here do you To be constructive, are the soft corals down current of the elegance? Perhaps you could place the elegance close to the inlet of the FF and perhaps using some carbon. BTW, how long has the X-PO4 been running for, perhaps you need some fresh stuff in to get the PO4 down to near zero???? Andy Andy, This Elegance is so big , it is really hard to place it. It really is a beautiful specimen! The way the currents in the tank are laid out, it sort of swirls in the tank. It does not really have a particular direction. You could be right about the X-P04 needing to be changed. It has been in there for about 2 weeks. I know how you feel about Elegance Corals, but this thing is absolutely magnificent!!! Jola Jola, Don't get me wrong about Elegance's. I really think they are nice corals, I just think that they cause problems and one ends up having the tank setup up around them rather than them being an integrated part of the population. Andy Andy, I'm sorta inclined to agree with you about this, but, I will have to admit it is my favorite of all the corals. I like the iridescent green color and the tentacles. I guess one reason that I'm partial to the Elegance Corals, is because that they remind me of Anemones. I'm crazy about Anemones! And.....When I see Clowns in Anemones, I just about die! Has Albert told you about the Black and White Clowns? Jola Jola, We may (and I say may) need some carbon so I will get some off to you. From your descriptions things seem to be doing real well. The corals that are now not looking the way you want them look, eventually will. It is just a matter of time. Albert Albert, Well, I will try not to worry about them. I did move the Bubble up higher in the tank and further away from the Elegance than it was . Will post you tomorrow evening about its happiness in this location. Wish I could make everything in there as happy as that monster Brain! BTW, the ORP is up to 480, how's yours? Jola Jola, Yes let me know what the location changes did for the corals tomorrow. Your redox is up to 480 ... Mine, in the tank without the skimmer is a puny 461 (only) I guess that based on the water quality parameters in that tank all is Indeed well in Jo-Bert. Good job. Remember what I told you when that Brain came in. I did not particularly care for it too much. Maybe it just is not a real nice piece but let's see what we can do for it by using the additives and the KW and putting it in another location as you did. Albert Albert, You know, I really like Green Stripe Mushrooms. Every one of the GS Mushrooms that I had, all left their rock and migrated to a corner of the tank, right in behind the sand bar where you cant see them! If you pick one up, and move it to where you can see it, it goes right back over to the corner with the others! The one small rock that I had with GS Mushrooms on it , is completely bare now! They seem to love that corner, though! It did not matter where I moved that rock trying to satisfy them, they still migrated. What would happen if larger specimens of GS Mushrooms were introduced? Do you think they would want to migrate also? Jola Jola, You just wait and see, these mushrooms will start appearing in other spots in a few months. They move to where they feel comfortable with the water flow, the light and the nutrient supply. This is not something you have control over. Usually though IME when mushrooms start to move away from the rock they were on they also start to multiply and suddenly turn up in different places. It takes a while for this to happen but it does. Albert Albert, Well, that sure is interesting. Will keep you updated on this. Jola Jola, Re Mushrooms: Yes pls. do. This may take some time but it will happen eventually. How are the nitrates? Albert Albert, At 5:30 am on June 13 the Nitrate is 10ppm, pH-8.32, ORP-481. Jola Jola, Seems like that nitrate does not yet want to go down. Of course the tank is still a little "new" so let's give it some more time. I am not worried about it. You did not tell me what the PO4 level was. If it is low you can remove the X-Phos and the X-Sil from the tank. Yes pls. do and as discussed pls. perform a water change. Take the tests before the water change and about 1 hour afterwards. Thank you. Since the skimmer is down I would like to get redox readings too while the skimmer is off to see how the ORP evolves without the skimmer running. Pls. post those too. Merci Beaucoup. Albert Albert, The ORP dropped from 481 to 471 in the 24 hours after the skimmer went out. Jola Jola, Nothing to worry about. That is still a very good number. The new venturis will arrive today so you can put the skimmer back in operation. The tank I have that does not have a skimmer on it (with live sand and plenum) runs at 440 now. That is far higher than many tanks I know that have a lot of other gear on it No it would not help to introduce more of them at this stage. Let's first see what the ones that are there do. Maybe at some later point we will add some different kinds. Albert Albert, Yes, On Friday, June 9th, I fed the processed Scallop, on Saturday the 10th, I fed the Elegance, the Brain, and the Bubble a small piece of the cooked shrimp . I'm- very - attentive to the additives, as you well know! Jola Jola, ref.: your message on feeding That should be enough food until this coming Friday or Saturday. Re the activated carbon: - rinse it well as during travel the friction between the pellets will have create a lot of fines (dust). - use 1/4 cup - check every 30 minutes or so to determine if you see anything change in the tank. Pls. let us know what you observe if anything. If after 6 hours nothing has changed remove the carbon. Could you pls. give us all an up-date on what is happening to Jo-Bert in terms of what the tank looks like etc. ... Also can you run all the usual tests and post the results. No rush. Thank you. Yes pls. do so. Thanks. You are sure putting a lot of effort into all of this and I commend you for your dedication to the project. Albert Albert, Thanks for the "pat on the back"! Coming from you , it does mean a lot. I am trying my best. I want Jo-Bert to be the best that it can be! When I see that every inhabitant in Jo-Bert thrives, I think that we will have achieved success with this project. I guess that you know by now, that I am a perfectionist. Jo-Bert must achieve perfection! Jola Jola, As in all things, nothing is forever. Tanks will have a rate of die off regardless of how well you take care of them. Some animals die for reason unknown to us and with which we really have nothing to do even though we give them the best care we know. It just is a fact that lifeforms in the tank will tend to come and go so to speak and that from time to time something Albert After you put the carbon in and based on my message from yesterday pls. let us know what differences if any, you notice. Thank you. Albert Albert, I added the carbon at around 4:30 pm. At 5pm, no change was noticed. At 5:30, the changes noticed were as follows: The Elegance completely opened, the tentacles were longer than usual, it seems more radiant than ever. The Ricordia Mushrooms are laying open , rather than trumpeting , better than they were. The Brain is just bigger than it was , even. The Leather is a little bigger and tentacles are coming out more than they were. The Bubble is a little better than it was. Jola Jola, From what you describe it would appear that we indeed had some toxins in the water and the small amount of carbon we used got rid of them. Let me know what you find (see) when you get home today. I assume the carbon is still in there. Albert Albert, Yes, I still have the carbon in the sump. The Elegance and the Brain are just really showing off! The Leather and the Devil's Hand are just still pretty much upset. The Bubble is still upset, as well. All in all, everything does look better than it did without the carbon. Jola Jola, Let's take a good look at everything when the skimmer is back up and running and then decide what we want to do. Normally I do not like to keep carbon in the system ALL the time so I will probably have you remove the 2nd batch after a day or two. Albert Albert, It is 2:30pm, and I just got the skimmer back on. It was the venturi causing the problems, because it is working just fine now. Jola Jola, Glad to hear that the skimmer is working fine now. Let me know how the water quality is changing. Thanks. Since the skimmer has not been running for a while it may just be that the foam will be more plentiful than you expect so it would be a good idea to watch the skimmer closely. Albert Albert, At 6pm, : No change noted from the 5:30 reading , except the Leather is a little more withdrawn and so are its tentacles, than the previous reading. Jola Jola, Thanks for keeping me posted on the effect of the carbon. Pls. change it today after you have posted your observations. We used so little of it that a change would be beneficial to see what the results are after putting in a new batch. Albert Albert, It is 9:30 pm, I will add fresh carbon and post you tomorrow pm of any effects. Jola Albert, Test results at 7pm on June 14th are as follows: ORP- 471 Nitrate - 9 mg/l pH- 8.41 Nitrite-0 Ammo- 0 PO4- 0.1 KH- 12 degrees Ca- 510 SG- 1.025 Temp- 80 O2- 6 mg/l Jola Jola, That nitrate still has not gone down to the levels I would like it to see go down. We will have to give it some more time. The one good thing is that even though the animal population has increased the NO3 has not gone up. Let's see what it is after the water change. The dKH is on the high side. Let's take a look at it after the water change too. I would really like to see it in the vicinity of 7 dKH. The oxygen level is on the low side. Let's see what the test comes up with after the water change and after the skimmer has been running for a while. 6 is low. The ORP will always drop after a water change because the ORP of the water you add is lower than the ORP of the water in the tank. It takes anywhere from a few hours to maybe 10 to 12 for the ORP to go back up and for the conditions to improve. When you have time, run another battery of tests pls. A drop of only the one you experienced after the water change is actually very good. Many find that when they do a 10 percent water change the ORP drops more than that. Take a look in the morning and see what it is and post me a note will you. Thanks Albert Albert, At 9pm , which was around an hour after the 10% water change to Jo-Bert , test results were as follows: SG- 1.025 O2- 7 mg/l ORP- 459 Nitrate - 9 mg/l pH- 8.41 KH- 12 degrees Jola Jola, Well those numbers are better in terms of O2. It increased by 1 and that is good. Good, especially since you have no skimmer running. Of course the tank has good water currents. That would help too. Let's watch the O2 and see what happens to it after you put the skimmer back in service today. Let's also take a morning reading tomorrow or so before the lights go on. Surprised the dKH remained at 12 even after the water change. Can you check the dKH of the prepared salt water mix before you add it. Or, if you have a little left now pls. perform a dKH test on it. Thanks. Albert Albert, The dKH of the RO water in the vat is 6 degrees. Jola Jola : Yes, you told me when we spoke on the phone that that was after you added the salt. That is actually what it is supposed to be based on our testing here at our warehouse. The addl. 6 dKH has to come from somewhere. Now we just have to figure out where it is coming from. Albert Albert, The vat water that I mentioned in the previous message is mixed saltwater. That dKH is 6 degrees. The dKH of just raw RO water is 0. Jola Jola : Yes thank you for letting me know. That is exactly what it should be. As I said in a previous message we now have to figure out where the 6 extra dKH is coming from. We'll talk on the phone about this and then post messages once we have determined the cause. Albert Albert, Yes that is a surprise. Given there is 200l in the tank, I calculate that the NO3 should have dropped to 7 mg/l. Odd indeed! Andy Andy : Indeed that would be approx. what it should have been. I can only surmise that nitrate that was non-dissolved and deposited on the rock went into solution when the water change was actually performed. Albert Albert, Hmmm maybe ... what sort of chemical process are you thinking of where NO3 first gets ppt'd and then redisolved? Andy Andy : small pH changes on the rock itself. Albert Jola, I notice the ORP went up a little in a short time. Have a look at it this morning and then again when you get home today. Thanks. Albert Albert, At 2pm, the ORP is 467. Jola Jola: No change in the NO3 after the water change. Strange. Let's wait till the skimmer is up and running again and then do another test the way I described earlier with the dilution of water. Make sure the vial is really clean and that you do not touch the inside of it and the bottom of the cap with your fingers. Rinse it with tap water first a couple of times and then rinse it several times with aquarium water. Check the RO you add to really make sure it does not have NO3 in it please. Thanks. Albert ALL RIGHTS RESERVED - FOR REVIEW ONLY - NO RIGHTS GRANTED This file is distributed by PetsForum Group through its forums on CompuServe for personal use only. Other distribution or use requires the written permission of the copyright holder and the PetsForum Group.